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Author Topic: Talkin' About The Elections thread of ELECTION DAY  (Read 1524924 times)

January 12, 2008, 08:09:57 PM
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Tenniru

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Talkin' About The Elections thread of ELECTION DAY
« on: January 12, 2008, 08:09:57 PM »
Election day edit:

GO VOTE

-Sz


****

It's primary season. Apparently if I'm 18 before the general elections, I'm allowed to vote in the primary even while I'm still 17. So I registered. Finally.

This topic is for the discussion of the current presidential race; both parties.

--DEMOCRATS--

I'll be voting in the Democrat primary in Virginia, even though I really am not that much of a Dem anymore; you have Nancy Pelosi to thank for that. Who will I vote for? Mike Gravel. He's losing horribly, but he's the only Democrat candidate I can trust; this is the same guy who revealed the Pentagon Papers during Vietnam, and the only one who seems serious about anything. I also agree with most of his views.

However, it looks like the race is between Obama and Clinton. New Hampshire hurt him, but if he can take South Carolina (which he probably will, looking at his 13-point poll average lead) he can get back in front and maybe even win. If he does so, I'll vote for him over any Republican but McCain or Rudy. If it's Hillary, I'd vote for any Republican but Huckabee (I do not like Huckabee).
Hillary's national poll lead, which she's had since the beginning, has fallen to five points and may be Obama's by South Carolina. If he takes that, Hillary is in big trouble.

--THE REPUBLICANS--

You may not guess it, but they are just as scared of another Bush as we are. They're trying to find a straight fiscal conservative and not really caring about social issues, since the last time they voted for a compassionate likable conservative they wound up getting a fiscally insane guy who expanded government significantly. This means the person they want least is Huckabee (well, and Ron Paul); they're just trying to decide who that other guy is. Thompson is dead meat, but for some reason won't drop out until South Carolina when Huckabee smashes him. He'll then endorse McCain. Romney will still have credibility until he loses Michigan to McCain (who has a four-point lead there). It's looking more and more like John McCain will be it, unless Rudy's plan of "bet everything on Super Tuesday" works somehow.
My favorite is Rudy, but he's pretty much gone (he even lost his national lead to McCain). I'd also vote McCain, and Romney only if Hillary wins. The back of my brain does see some appeal in Ron Paul, but only because having some lunatic vetoing every single bill would FORCE the Congress to set side bipartisanship and unite to override his veto pen.

On the subject of Congress, I don't expect the Dems to hold on in there. The whole anthem of government shakeup and revolution melted into a malaise of inactivity and the same old corruption, and to make things worse (for them) Iraq is starting to go better. Not that they've even bothered to show any backbone on that subject.

Also, who will the Vice President be? Edwards is saying he doesn't want to be anyone's vice president again, but Richardson, Biden, and Dodd are distinct possibilities (if it isn't someone else entirely).

Huckabee may not be a favorite among Republicans as a policy leader, but they do acknowledge his likability factor. He could easily be the vice president, but probably not for Romney (they've been really going after eachother). Romney and Rudy are too in-charge people to take a back seat, McCain has never expressed any possibility for it before, and nobody cares about Hunter/Tancredo/Brownback. Paul and Keyes are just impossible.

Meanwhile, the Independents. The Libretarians are a nonentity, as they're split between the more popular Paul and themselves. Maybe the popularity of the R(Love)ution could make them something notable in 2012. One Green Party nominee is the notorious Cynthia McKinney, the ex-Democrat who refused to show ID to a House of Representatives guard, punched him, and then accused him of racism. After losing the re-election primary in '06, she gave a farewell speech praising Hugo Chavez and Fidel Castro.
Meanwhile, Ralph Nader appears to be set to run only if Hillary wins. If it's Obama, he's gone.

Preferences? Predictions? Pontifications?
« Last Edit: November 04, 2008, 01:27:25 AM by Sz »

January 12, 2008, 08:14:10 PM
Reply #1

Squiggles the Chao

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Re: Talkin' About The Elections
« Reply #1 on: January 12, 2008, 08:14:10 PM »
TBH, I'm kinda shocked that Tenniru likes 9/11 Man. If there's anyone who won't allow Tenniru (or anyone else) to have a spaceship, it's Giuliani.

January 12, 2008, 08:31:01 PM
Reply #2

Sz

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Re: Talkin' About The Elections
« Reply #2 on: January 12, 2008, 08:31:01 PM »
Obama or Huckabee. Preferably the former.

Everybody else (as far as main candidates go) is going to lead to some bitter tears and possibly me voting for Colbert.

January 12, 2008, 08:33:18 PM
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Tenniru

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Re: Talkin' About The Elections
« Reply #3 on: January 12, 2008, 08:33:18 PM »
9/11 or not, I like the way he ran New York and I like his stances on gay marriage/abortion. Executive branch experience is VERY important in my book; I'm sorry, the military and the Senate just doesn't scream "experience in administration" like Governor or Mayor.

January 12, 2008, 08:45:41 PM
Reply #4

Kyon

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Re: Talkin' About The Elections
« Reply #4 on: January 12, 2008, 08:45:41 PM »
I'm really not sure. If it comes down to it, I will vote any way that stops Hillary from entering that office. She haets video games. Since I live in CA, a democrat will win. I just want one that's not her. And for the election itself, I'll do the same, if she somehow makes it. I'm sorry, but you can't campaign as an outside for change and have Bill standing next to you. Obama seems to be the best way to accomplish my goals, so go Obama?
5/19/08 - NEVER FORGET

January 12, 2008, 09:22:10 PM
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Matt_TY

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Re: Talkin' About The Elections
« Reply #5 on: January 12, 2008, 09:22:10 PM »
Not American, but if I was I'd be going for Obama. Politics is much more party- than candidate-oriented over here so I'm probably too stubborn to pick a Republican candidate, but... probably Giuliani if I was forced.
AND SUCH

January 12, 2008, 09:27:50 PM
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noby

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Re: Talkin' About The Elections
« Reply #6 on: January 12, 2008, 09:27:50 PM »
I'm aching for Obama to win. He's the only one of the candidates with real-world experience and real ideas and solutions, who doesn't talk politicianese and dance around issues. He's also extremely engaging when he gives his speeches. Christ he's wonderful, I wanna marry him.

Hillary is a horrible person with vagina in her teeth, and I'll die if she wins. Absolutely zero of the republicans have any worth. McCain might have a few years ago, but it seems he got his old person card and turned into a crotchety fart now.

January 12, 2008, 09:33:27 PM
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Nik Jam

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Re: Talkin' About The Elections
« Reply #7 on: January 12, 2008, 09:33:27 PM »
Rudy was probably the worst mayor in NYC history, what good has he ever done?

January 12, 2008, 09:46:23 PM
Reply #8

Sz

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Re: Talkin' About The Elections
« Reply #8 on: January 12, 2008, 09:46:23 PM »
Rudy would be a brutally bad president, IMO. Thankfully it looks like he has very little chance now.

I agree with Scott about McCain -- I really wish he would've beat Bush for that spot 8 years ago (if only...), but now I think he's just too damn old.

Romney is worthless.

January 12, 2008, 09:57:33 PM
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Shinde

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Re: Talkin' About The Elections
« Reply #9 on: January 12, 2008, 09:57:33 PM »
I'm hoping for an Obama-Edwards (or vice versa) ticket. The latter has support from many unions, including the ones to which my parents belong, so having him on board would likely help benefit the workforce a lot more. I'm not sure what to think about Hillary. Granted, she does have experience from Bill's time as president, but somehow I don't feel as if it's time for her to take the stage just yet. After all, all of the candidates' platforms involve "change"-- would it really be a "change" if we continued the Bush-Clinton game of tag?

Republican-wise, there aren't any strong candidates at all. Romney is weird, McCain has age against him, and I hate Giuliani for his constant "9/11" word-dropping in his speeches. We get it, man, you led NYC through it, but if you're going to base your campaign on a single event in the past, you're probably not going to do well. Also, skipping Iowa and New Hampshire probably won't bode well for him in the long run.

Speaking of Iowa, on behalf of the state I apologize for allowing Huckabee win the Republican Caucuses.
Formerly: NeoSonic | Capt. Neo | Anavel Gato | That one guy who likes cop stuff | Neo Classic.

January 12, 2008, 10:07:56 PM
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Kiddo Cabbusses

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Re: Talkin' About The Elections
« Reply #10 on: January 12, 2008, 10:07:56 PM »
To summarize, no one I like even has a remote chance of winning. As usual.

January 12, 2008, 10:11:17 PM
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Jolly Joes

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Re: Talkin' About The Elections
« Reply #11 on: January 12, 2008, 10:11:17 PM »
OBAMA 2008!

God, I can't believe the NH primaries between Clinton and Obama was so close. Though it seemed that the majority of the voters there were folks 45+ years of age. I have a feeling if so many young folks weren't so appathetic on voting, Obama could have won it. =(

January 12, 2008, 10:14:03 PM
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brainduster

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Re: Talkin' About The Elections
« Reply #12 on: January 12, 2008, 10:14:03 PM »
I'm aching for Obama to win. . .

yadda yadda yadda

Yeah, pretty much.  Of all the candidates, qualifications and experience aside, I think Obama would probably be the best one aesthetically.  His speech-power and overall look just oozes "I ought to be in charge of something, like a country".

Hillary is a big "no", anybody who believes video games incite murderchurching ought to be held away from having real ultimate power in a country, and while I'm not a republiate I wouldn't even want to vote for any of those running.  McCain a few years back, sure, but not now.  "President Huckabee" is a cringe-worthy title, Giuliani is a one-trick horse and Romney isn't all that exciting or necessary, I'd say.

Funfortunately enough, I am essentially flying blind and Very American™ as far as liking various candidates goes.  I haven't been keeping up too well on who likes what.  Is there anywhere to find that sort of thing aside from day-to-day news?

January 12, 2008, 11:30:10 PM
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Tenniru

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Re: Talkin' About The Elections
« Reply #13 on: January 12, 2008, 11:30:10 PM »

January 12, 2008, 11:34:27 PM
Reply #14

ila

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Re: Talkin' About The Elections
« Reply #14 on: January 12, 2008, 11:34:27 PM »
I was going to take you seriously until you mentioned Gravel. We didn't even have a place for him at the caucuses here. Hes not a serious candidate, all he did was say some "witty" things to get 5 minutes of attention.

January 12, 2008, 11:39:21 PM
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Squiggles the Chao

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Re: Talkin' About The Elections
« Reply #15 on: January 12, 2008, 11:39:21 PM »
Actually, Gravel was the second-to last Democrat on my list (all the Dems were above Republicans) above Richardson. Still, I don't think that survey accurately represents me. For example, what if I don't support tightening border security in any way? I'm not saying that I don't, but there was no option for that. Secondly, the only issue I disagreed with Obama on was the death penalty. Whereas for Hillary, it was the death penalty and No Child Left Behind. But there are a lot more of her policies that I disagree with.

January 12, 2008, 11:45:54 PM
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Tenniru

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Re: Talkin' About The Elections
« Reply #16 on: January 12, 2008, 11:45:54 PM »
I never said Gravel was a serious candidate. I just like him the most. You can tell he's trustworthy because he's losing so badly.

January 13, 2008, 12:04:54 AM
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ila

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Re: Talkin' About The Elections
« Reply #17 on: January 13, 2008, 12:04:54 AM »
Posted edited.

I'm sorry for my brashness in this topic.
« Last Edit: January 13, 2008, 12:20:37 AM by ila »

January 13, 2008, 12:22:00 AM
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Tenniru

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Re: Talkin' About The Elections
« Reply #18 on: January 13, 2008, 12:22:00 AM »
I'm voting for Gravel, which is the same thing.

In all seriousness, he does seem like the most consistent, non-flip-floppy candidate out of the bunch. He's also the biggest serious anti-war guy in the running (that whole Pentagon Papers thing kind of helps). This means I have a good deal more trust when I agree with him on things that separate him from the other Dems: his take on healthcare (socializing it works so long as it's not Hillary's attempts), immigration (actually securing the borders AND guest-worker programs plus ditching NAFTA), the War on Drugs, and his education plan. He'd also have more of a backbone to actually do things, unlike the Pelosi Democrats who seemed to get elected and be content with twiddling their thumbs and ask for more votes and money (despite how determined they were as a minority party).


January 13, 2008, 01:25:12 AM
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Re: Talkin' About The Elections
« Reply #19 on: January 13, 2008, 01:25:12 AM »
You guys are idiots. How can you like Gravel and Giuliani? One's the most left-wing super-pacifist politician I've seen in America in a long time, the other is a right-wing hyper-militaristic douche. You're like the Digg nutjobs that go "I kinda liked Obama but... RON PAUL 2008!" They are coming from opposite directions and completely unlike each other! You're getting absorbed in retarded soundbites and their ability to target you with one or two particular issues that catch your attention. It almost seems like you'll all vote for some idiot Republican if Clinton gets the nomination just to protect your goddamn videogames from a faded talking point she used to have.

Anyway, I don't have a favourite candidate. I love Gravel and think he mirrors my political ideas perfectly, but he's obviously not a "real" candidate with any chance of winning. Obama talks a lot of bullshit, and seems super-moderate, and while Edwards has some alright policies he doesn't seem that different from Obama to me. I guess I'll be pleased if Obama makes it (and will probably get Vero to vote for him) but I wish he was less about Hope and Change for America and more about, like.. providing universal healthcare and pulling out of Iraq. (Kucinich is also cool, btw, slightly less hardcore than Gravel and slightly less long-shot, but still long-shot enough to be ignorable. Hope he gets the VP!)

As for the Repiglicans (lol) I think they're all pretty sleazy. McCain seems like a principled guy but he sold out on a lot of things to get support, and would probably be an awful president. As for Ron Paul, I can't wait to see him drop out. I hate libertarians, they might be honest but they'll fuck the world up bad.

P.S. Does anyone know how you can vote in the New Jersey Democratic primary? Veronica is a US Citizen living abroad, and I only found one site (rock the vote?) that lets you sign up, but it requires you to be living in the US and mail a letter.
Visit Soaringrabbit.com, home of Soaring Rabbit, a Keio Flying Squadron fansite, Rampaging Feline, which is all about Di Gi Charat, Bombastic Bunny, my blog about technology and stuff, or maybe even Bittersweet Candy Bowl, Veronica's wonderful comic.

January 13, 2008, 02:19:15 AM
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Nik Jam

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Re: Talkin' About The Elections
« Reply #20 on: January 13, 2008, 02:19:15 AM »
People will make excuses not to support Clinton, but the primary reason is probably sexism.

January 13, 2008, 02:51:32 AM
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Tenniru

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Re: Talkin' About The Elections
« Reply #21 on: January 13, 2008, 02:51:32 AM »
I have a theory about politics. It's not a straight line from left to right, but a globe. On the north pole are the "moderates" we know; middle-of-the-road guys like McCain, Rudy, and such. Then the Canada/Britain area, with standard Republicans and standard Democrats. The equator, with Moore leftists and Robertson rightists. Then the south pole, where the "extremists" are; Ron Paul and Mike Gravel (and beyond).
It's worth mentioning that Ron Paul is basically an isolationist whose solutions to the foreign relations issues involve hiding. Then you have Nader/Gravel/etc leftists who also seem intent in staying totally out of foreign deals. Both are for small government power; stay out of money, stay out of privacy, et cetera. This makes the farthest-right and farthest-left candidates both pro-choice, pro-gay-marriage, anti-PATRIOT-act, anti-war.
The only real difference; one is free-market capitalist

I also don't really see Rudy as being that right-wing. Most of his 9/11 touting is just politics; what better way to manipulate Republicans than with 9/11, and who better to do it than the guy who was mayor at the time? A lot of his policy isn't exactly extreme right-wing either; asking illegal immigrants to come forward with reports of crime, being pro-choice and pro-gay-marriage, wearing dresses, gun control, and such.
(It's also worth mentioning that just as Rudy is only conservative fiscally, Bush is only conservative socially. Dubya is the definition of huge-government bearoucracy, fiscal irresponsibility, overreaching laws, and overcentralized national government.)

I honestly do not see sexism being a thing preventing people from being pro-Hillary. I think a lot of it is just that people don't like her. Proof: if Oprah ran for president, would she win? Yes.

January 13, 2008, 04:03:22 AM
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SuitCase

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Re: Talkin' About The Elections
« Reply #22 on: January 13, 2008, 04:03:22 AM »
Political Compass suits my narrow world view.

Visit Soaringrabbit.com, home of Soaring Rabbit, a Keio Flying Squadron fansite, Rampaging Feline, which is all about Di Gi Charat, Bombastic Bunny, my blog about technology and stuff, or maybe even Bittersweet Candy Bowl, Veronica's wonderful comic.

January 13, 2008, 05:49:35 AM
Reply #23

Perfect Chaos Zero

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Re: Talkin' About The Elections
« Reply #23 on: January 13, 2008, 05:49:35 AM »
You guys are idiots. How can you like Gravel and Giuliani? One's the most left-wing super-pacifist politician I've seen in America in a long time, the other is a right-wing hyper-militaristic douche. You're like the Digg nutjobs that go "I kinda liked Obama but... RON PAUL 2008!" They are coming from opposite directions and completely unlike each other! You're getting absorbed in retarded soundbites and their ability to target you with one or two particular issues that catch your attention. It almost seems like you'll all vote for some idiot Republican if Clinton gets the nomination just to protect your goddamn videogames from a faded talking point she used to have.

Anyway, I don't have a favourite candidate. I love Gravel and think he mirrors my political ideas perfectly, but he's obviously not a "real" candidate with any chance of winning. Obama talks a lot of bullshit, and seems super-moderate, and while Edwards has some alright policies he doesn't seem that different from Obama to me. I guess I'll be pleased if Obama makes it (and will probably get Vero to vote for him) but I wish he was less about Hope and Change for America and more about, like.. providing universal healthcare and pulling out of Iraq. (Kucinich is also cool, btw, slightly less hardcore than Gravel and slightly less long-shot, but still long-shot enough to be ignorable. Hope he gets the VP!)

As for the Repiglicans (lol) I think they're all pretty sleazy. McCain seems like a principled guy but he sold out on a lot of things to get support, and would probably be an awful president. As for Ron Paul, I can't wait to see him drop out. I hate libertarians, they might be honest but they'll fuck the world up bad.

P.S. Does anyone know how you can vote in the New Jersey Democratic primary? Veronica is a US Citizen living abroad, and I only found one site (rock the vote?) that lets you sign up, but it requires you to be living in the US and mail a letter.


I recall a certain someone going on and on about how much they loved George Bush in #srb2 and then getting essentially bitched out of the channel by everyone there until they got fed up and left. That's not such a great feeling is it Suity? My point? Suit, I really wish you or anyone else for that matter wouldn't call people stupid for their political beliefs, especially when in reference to a country you don't live in. It's extremely rude and frankly, offensive. There's nothing wrong with disagreeing, but "you're stupid" is a rather uncivilized way of getting one's opinion's across, don't you think? Perhaps an alternative such as, "I feel your opinions are unwise because..."? People should just chill out and not get fired up to the point that they degrade to insults over a little political debate. I'm not trying to be forum police here, that's not my job nor do I want it to be, I never said you or anyone couldn't do something or anything like that. I'm just saying that bad vibes totally kill my forum buzz and I wish we could all get along, in a nice, civil conversation about those running. =/


As for myself, I support Gravel because I essentially agree with his policies almost entirely down the board. I've been a member of his site for sometime. Sadly, it seems more and more likely that we won't get the chance to be noticed enough to win. If Hilary becomes the democratic nominee, I'd be rather at a lost as to what to do, as she's fucking crazy IMO. But then again, Obama and Edwards are douchebags in their own rights and I don't much care for most republicans. I'm not really sure who I'll actually vote for in the end, but I don't much like what my options are turning out to be.
« Last Edit: January 13, 2008, 06:08:02 AM by Perfect Chaos Zero »

January 13, 2008, 09:50:04 AM
Reply #24

SuitCase

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Re: Talkin' About The Elections
« Reply #24 on: January 13, 2008, 09:50:04 AM »
Yeah, shut up. You can't take jokes about anything. Go start a PAC about how mean I am or something. (Or a forum, lol!)

As for your second paragraph, I hope people aren't disillusioned when it all goes down. I think it's really really sad how few people vote over there, and I would be pretty upset with anyone I knew who didn't educate themselves and vote in the coming election.
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