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Author Topic: So... that whole GamersGate thing  (Read 84446 times)

January 14, 2015, 02:30:27 PM
Reply #275

Squishdiboo

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Re: So... that whole GamersGate thing
« Reply #275 on: January 14, 2015, 02:30:27 PM »
Question: what does "being pro-Gamergate" mean? This thread is too long and at this point the tweets and posts and everything else aren't making any sense to me.

January 14, 2015, 09:38:06 PM
Reply #276

Keith Stack

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Re: So... that whole GamersGate thing
« Reply #276 on: January 14, 2015, 09:38:06 PM »
Being pro-Gamergate means you care so deeply about the integrity of video game news websites that you tweet about it every day.

My phone autocorrected GAMERA to GAMERS earlier today.

January 14, 2015, 09:40:25 PM
Reply #277

AnKylo

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Re: So... that whole GamersGate thing
« Reply #277 on: January 14, 2015, 09:40:25 PM »
Such a sin is blasphemous to the friend of children everywhere.

January 15, 2015, 04:05:47 AM
Reply #278

Squishdiboo

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Re: So... that whole GamersGate thing
« Reply #278 on: January 15, 2015, 04:05:47 AM »
I don't get how people can keep having things to say about a single topic after more than a couple weeks. I don't know how bronies are still going on about my little pony. I don't know how people are still talking about gamer gate. I don't know how we keep having threads about sonic the hedgehog here.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2015, 09:35:58 PM by Squishdiboo »

January 15, 2015, 09:41:12 AM
Reply #279

yaj

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Re: So... that whole GamersGate thing
« Reply #279 on: January 15, 2015, 09:41:12 AM »
"So..that whole GamersCape thing."

it's kind of interesting, and really confusing (to me)

it seems like it's about certain video games not being nerdy enough to be video games, and certain people not being nerdy enough to be gamers. also the portrayal of women in video games. then it escalated into some guy sleeping with a girl, and the guy was part of a panel of judges, and she won. then something about cyber bullying. i lost track of how these things are all connected.

this entire thing reminds me of that documentary where the one guy said pac-man wasn't a real game, and missile command was.

January 15, 2015, 01:39:05 PM
Reply #280

Sofox

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Re: So... that whole GamersGate thing
« Reply #280 on: January 15, 2015, 01:39:05 PM »
- video games not being nerdy enough to be video games

Its more that some games are getting large amounts of promotion because the developers have connections with the journalists, and because the journalist tend to push certain games as part of the political beliefs of the journalists (and by the same token, are criticising perfectly fine games because they don't fit into said ideology). Then they claim that any way of viewing the games that doesn't agree with them is "conservative" and "misogynistic".

- certain people not being nerdy enough to be gamers
It's more "people who genuinely don't play video games expounding on how video games need to change and shaming those who don't agree".

- portrayal of women in video games
Anti-GG have lots to say on this, pro-GG don't care that much one way or the other as long as the game is good. However, they take issue with huge, high standards being applied to female character, when the same standards aren't applied to male characters.

- then it escalated into some guy sleeping with a girl, and the guy was part of a panel of judges, and she won
This is conflating two issues:
A game developer had a relationship with a games journalist, the journalist
People who invested in Phil Fish's game Fez ended up as judges for it in a indie competition, and Fez ended up winning... twice on different years.

- cyber bullying

Done by both sides unfortunatley, for example: https://jennofhardwire.wordpress.com/2015/01/06/gamers-discussing-gamergate-scandal-are-being-harassed-wheres-the-coverage-this-article-will-be-regularly-updated-with-documented-harassment-of-gamers/

-i lost track of how these things are all connected
Not surprising, one of the most frustrating things about GamerGate is how, because gaming journalists are accused in all this, they don't cover the issue with detail making it very hard to research.

January 15, 2015, 05:53:23 PM
Reply #281

yaj

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Re: So... that whole GamersGate thing
« Reply #281 on: January 15, 2015, 05:53:23 PM »
- video games not being nerdy enough to be video games

Its more that some games are getting large amounts of promotion because the developers have connections with the journalists, and because the journalist tend to push certain games as part of the political beliefs of the journalists (and by the same token, are criticising perfectly fine games because they don't fit into said ideology). Then they claim that any way of viewing the games that doesn't agree with them is "conservative" and "misogynistic".

Okay, it sounds like what you're talking about (and the scene this entire thing is centered around) is independent video games, so I can't really comment on that. I was basing this observation on something about Candy Crush on twitter, and I thought this comment was the general consensus with the gamer gate folks.  Hasn't there always been a certain subset of games that the hard core gamer's look down on? Like puzzle games. That tweet made me think that this might be part of the debate.

Yeah, I know things have gotten nasty on both sides. I wasn't trying to imply that it was just the anti gamer gate people that were being bullied. There's been accusations on both sides, but substantiating the accusations gets a little tricky. Anybody can pretend to be pro gamersgate, and vice versa.

I'm trying to understand something. What made people question the impartiality of the judges in this indie game competition? Was one of them the journalist that slept with the game developer you mentioned? Sorry I'm pretty dense, and forgot the stuff I read about before.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2015, 07:18:24 PM by yaj »

January 15, 2015, 06:32:45 PM
Reply #282

Sofox

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Re: So... that whole GamersGate thing
« Reply #282 on: January 15, 2015, 06:32:45 PM »
I haven't seen Candy Crush or any such "causal" games mentioned as part of GamerGate. I know there's always a bit of snobbery with one group of gamers looking down on type of games but within GamerGate, the issues is that games are certain being overhyped for the two reasons I mentioned above.

-What made people question the impartiality of the judges in this indie game competition?

This article contains the most concrete evidence: http://gamesnosh.com/fez-investors-outed-judges-2011-igf-award/

January 15, 2015, 07:22:12 PM
Reply #283

yaj

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Re: So... that whole GamersGate thing
« Reply #283 on: January 15, 2015, 07:22:12 PM »
Ah okay, thanks. That should help clarify some things.

To be fair I found the insult by doing a google search for candy crush+gamersgate on google after reading a comment on a huffpo article that said "Playing Candy Crush doesn't make you a gamer." So maybe I was looking too hard for that connection. This insult was bandied about by certain people, but they may not have been affiliated with pro gamersgate folks.

January 15, 2015, 08:25:17 PM
Reply #284

James

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Re: So... that whole GamersGate thing
« Reply #284 on: January 15, 2015, 08:25:17 PM »
ABC ran a heavily-biased segment on Nightline about how GG = MISOGYNY & HARASSMENT, using outdated/officially debunked information and only talking to notorious anti-GG figures for recorded interviews.

It's sad when Comedy Central handles reporting on an issue much better than you, and they edit for the sake of comedy and time.

The icing on the cake? Juju, the woman that made the segment, has been blocking whoever points out the flaws in the segment.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2015, 08:28:54 PM by James »

January 16, 2015, 12:20:59 PM
Reply #285

David The Lurker

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Re: So... that whole GamersGate thing
« Reply #285 on: January 16, 2015, 12:20:59 PM »
I would like to ask a simple question

Looking at your feed of nonstop tweets (why is it nonstop), at one point a 2011 Leigh Alexander tweet is dragged out of the mothballs where she says the following:

"Real career women don't have kids. We know it's best for everyone."

The screenshot of this tweet is given the gamergate hashtag, and you have a bit of a shout at her because of your mother's situation. Now, yes. Her statement is a bit silly. Plenty of career women have kids. Plenty of career women also don't have kids. And some who do have kids end up ignoring their kids, which is probably what she was referencing, even though that is still a negative viewpoint on the entire thing. But my question is this.

What does that have to do with video games.

Because as far as I can tell? That right there has nothing to do with video game journalism. Yes, she writes about video games, but she is stating an opinion, and everyone has biases. Journalist are no exception, but what's important is that they don't allow those biases to influence their work. If Leigh wrote an opinion piece where she echoes that idea, even if you disagree with it, that's fine. If she's writing a report that's about facts and she throws that in there for the hell of it, then yes, that's bad. But her just writing a tweet that, over three years later, people decide to get mad about it because of something completely unrelated? And trying to use that as evidence in some grander scheme? That's what I don't understand.

<Keith> MANY PEOPLE ON EVAN'S FLOOR ARE PROBABLY YIFFING RIGHT NOW.

January 16, 2015, 02:21:38 PM
Reply #286

James

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Re: So... that whole GamersGate thing
« Reply #286 on: January 16, 2015, 02:21:38 PM »
Normally, I don't give two shits about Leigh (as is the standard because she'd proven herself to be so full of shit that hardly anyone takes her seriously). Seeing that screencapped tweet just... made me mad and set me off. Nobody has any right to declare what a "career woman" is and is supposed to be.

January 16, 2015, 02:43:12 PM
Reply #287

Vexiss

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Re: So... that whole GamersGate thing
« Reply #287 on: January 16, 2015, 02:43:12 PM »
I don't get how people can keep having things to say about a single topic after more than a couple weeks. I don't know how bronies are still going on about my little pony. I don't know how people are still talking about gamer gate. I don't know how we keep having threads about sonic the hedgehog here.
do we really still have threads about sonic

idk

i guess you just have no passion squish

January 16, 2015, 04:11:26 PM
Reply #288

James

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Re: So... that whole GamersGate thing
« Reply #288 on: January 16, 2015, 04:11:26 PM »

January 16, 2015, 06:56:18 PM
Reply #289

Squishdiboo

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Re: So... that whole GamersGate thing
« Reply #289 on: January 16, 2015, 06:56:18 PM »
I don't and I'm glad.

January 16, 2015, 10:14:06 PM
Reply #290

Keith Stack

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Re: So... that whole GamersGate thing
« Reply #290 on: January 16, 2015, 10:14:06 PM »
Normally, I don't give two shits about Leigh (as is the standard because she'd proven herself to be so full of shit that hardly anyone takes her seriously). Seeing that screencapped tweet just... made me mad and set me off. Nobody has any right to declare what a "career woman" is and is supposed to be.
Okay, sure, but why the GamerGate hashtag?

January 16, 2015, 10:16:18 PM
Reply #291

James

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Re: So... that whole GamersGate thing
« Reply #291 on: January 16, 2015, 10:16:18 PM »
Be honest - would you want that kind of thinking working its way into the gaming industry?

January 16, 2015, 11:28:03 PM
Reply #292

Keith Stack

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Re: So... that whole GamersGate thing
« Reply #292 on: January 16, 2015, 11:28:03 PM »
I'm fine with people having opinions I may disagree with work in the video game industry. For example, I love just about every game Doug TenNapell is associated with, even though I strongly disagree with his beliefs.

But regardless of my opinion, that tweet had no links to corruption in the video game industry. It was just someone sharing an opinion that differed from your own. You're sullying the name of the impeccable GamerGate movement!

January 17, 2015, 12:07:33 AM
Reply #293

Matt_TY

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Re: So... that whole GamersGate thing
« Reply #293 on: January 17, 2015, 12:07:33 AM »
TO be fair, Leigh Alexander has been one of the more prominent anti-GGers, to the point where one of her other opinions was that it's, quote "slimy" and "pandering" to be neutral on the matter, or believe that both sides have some valid points. SHe appears to divide the world into "people who unreservedly agree with everything she says" and "filthy misogynists" as a way to avoid having to defend, discuss or modify her opinions in any way.

To be fair again though, one of the major problems with both sides of the thing is the whole politicised "look what this person did that was bad, therefore the other side is evil and we are teh good guys" like this is a god-damned election campaign, and James, you kinda are playing into that still. Infact there was a state election campaign in my state going on at the same time as much of GamerGate and I've not been able to help but notice how similar the two things have been.

Somewhere on both sides there are people who actually want to talk to each other to fix things. I'm on the side of those people.
« Last Edit: January 17, 2015, 12:11:35 AM by Matt_TY »
AND SUCH

January 17, 2015, 01:54:53 AM
Reply #294

James

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Re: So... that whole GamersGate thing
« Reply #294 on: January 17, 2015, 01:54:53 AM »
I don't see what decrying the concept that mother =/= career woman has to do with politics. It''s a shitty mindset, plain and simple.

January 17, 2015, 08:24:31 AM
Reply #295

Matt_TY

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Re: So... that whole GamersGate thing
« Reply #295 on: January 17, 2015, 08:24:31 AM »
By "politics" I mean the whole "THEM BAD US GOOD" thing, rather than the content of the opinion itself. This one of THEM said something BAD because THEM BAD.
AND SUCH

January 17, 2015, 11:38:04 AM
Reply #296

AnKylo

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Re: So... that whole GamersGate thing
« Reply #296 on: January 17, 2015, 11:38:04 AM »
I'm not 100% into the Gamergate movement, but I still love this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DlSx7m09R60

January 17, 2015, 06:52:45 PM
Reply #297

TimmiT

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Re: So... that whole GamersGate thing
« Reply #297 on: January 17, 2015, 06:52:45 PM »
I think it's pretty silly to think that GamerGate actually can have a positive effect on game journalism now that it's so heavily affiliated with misogyny and harassment.

I also think it's pretty silly to think that a movement that has a lot of people from 4chan/8chan doesn't have a lot of toxicity in it and that it's just a minority or whatever.

Just saying. You can want to improve game journalism without retweeting a shitton of GamerGate bullshit that actually has barely anything to do with game journalism.
« Last Edit: January 17, 2015, 06:59:49 PM by TimmiT »

January 17, 2015, 09:34:18 PM
Reply #298

James

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Re: So... that whole GamersGate thing
« Reply #298 on: January 17, 2015, 09:34:18 PM »
Oh hello, utterly biased fuckface. What made you take your break from Twitter?

Did you have enough of the circlejerk of your willful ignorance there and decide to come here to go for a round of "Ignore the Facts Because I'm a Brainwashed Fucker Who Can't Get Off Without Arguing"?
« Last Edit: January 17, 2015, 10:42:09 PM by James »

January 17, 2015, 11:00:07 PM
Reply #299

Matt_TY

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Re: So... that whole GamersGate thing
« Reply #299 on: January 17, 2015, 11:00:07 PM »
-TimmiT: "YOU BAD US GOOD"
-James: "NO U"

*facepalm*
AND SUCH